[00:00:00] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Welcome to the Song Saloon. I'm singer songwriter Jordan Smith Reynolds. Each episode, I sit down with an artist and we talk about one of their songs. This week's guest is Rachel Siegel. Hi. Rachel Siegel is a New Jersey native living in la. She received her degree in songwriting from Berkeley College of Music and started her career helping other people tell their stories.

However, in 2020 when the world shut down, she decided it was time to tell her own Rachel's debut album. Heart Injuries Are Cumulative. Came out last year and she's looking forward to releasing new music throughout 2023. Welcome, Rachel.

[00:00:39] Rachel Siegel: Hi. Thank you so much for having me.

[00:00:42] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Yes. Thank you for being here. Tell us a little bit about the song you brought today.

[00:00:47] Rachel Siegel: So today we're gonna be listening to and talking about hell of a good time. It's a new song that I wrote coming off the tail end of the album. It was very sad and, and very focused on grief and my past and I I was trying to figure out what I wanted to talk about next and what, what parts of myself I wanted to show. And I, I have a coach that I work with a few times a month and he said, he was like, metaphorically, what would the name of your next album be called?

And I said, oh, I'm a hell of a good time. And so then I went off and I wrote that song and, and, It's been so cool to like, recognize that I'm not just like the grieving girl, but I'm fun, I'm intellectual. I'm like a million other things that that I get to show up as. And so that's kind of where hell of a good time came from.

[00:01:44] Jordan Smith Reynolds: That's great. I'd love to hear it just straight from that that introduction. Yeah.

[00:01:49] Rachel Siegel: Okay, let's do it.

[00:01:51] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Thank you.

All right. Thanks so much. That was great.

Yeah, it sounds like a bit of a, a contrast to your, to your last album. Tell me a bit about the difference not only in tone, but how that affected your writing. What was different about the writing process in this?

[00:05:25] Rachel Siegel: That's a great question. I think in the past I have been very like, Story driven and like, I have a, a story or a situation or concept that's like burning on my heart and in my head to write. And so I'll jump in from telling that story. And I think with this, I wrote the chorus and it was like this overarching concept.

And then I didn't necessarily have like a specific story. And so I sort of wrote the verses as like these vignettes of like, Like, I just thought the language of like Mr. Man, brother, man, lover, man was really playful and fun and like, I, it definitely crafted it in a bit of a different way because it didn't stem from a specific situation that I was trying to write.

[00:06:15] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Cool. Did you find that that affected the speed of the process at all? Knowing whether it was like something specific you were trying to, to write about versus more of a, general feeling,

[00:06:26] Rachel Siegel: it, it was kinda, it took like a medium length of time. It wasn't the shortest song I've ever written or the longest song at all. I originally had like, Only saying half of what the chorus is now, and then went into another melodic like section after that. Like, so the chorus was structured differently and then I, I showed a friend and and he was like, the verses are really fun.

You need to iron out some of the, like, the language. And then that chorus, like that really is your chorus. Like, it's like, He was like talking to what the references he came into in his head where he was like, it sounds like Imagine Dragony. And it's like this big chorus. And he was like, that's really your chorus, and then you going into the hell of the good time.

Like that might be all you need. And so then I had to, I like went back to it and restructured it a bit and, and came to this version.

[00:07:23] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Cool. So you'd kind of written a chorus on top of this and change it to more that just that line. Interesting. So I met you through the ASCAP event. It was what do they call it? The ASCAP experience. Right. And so Rachel was getting feedback on one of her songs at this event and And that's for the, the next song that's coming out, my revenge.

So be looking for that as well. And what I noticed about a lot of the advice they gave on songs in ASCAP was just that for the chorus is really keeping the chorus simple, punchy, and feeling good. Which I think this accomplishes really well. You can just sit in the hook for a little bit.

[00:08:03] Rachel Siegel: Yeah, I actually got some, I got some great feedback yesterday. Like an overarching feedback that I'm really excited to dive into of just about like focus and how like sometimes. It like shows like a bigger confidence to like pick a thing that you love and are convinced of and really hammer that home.

Home instead of adding all of these things and like continuing to pile on sounds or pile on melodies or pile, like whatever the thing is to like. I feel like you have to do all this work to create this world, but really like figuring out the pieces you're confident on and like really simplifying. And that felt really like resourceful to me and I'm excited to kind of apply that to what I'm doing on to many levels.

[00:08:52] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Yeah. Yes. Can we talk about the production process for these songs? Are you working with a collaborator? What does that look like? Like,

[00:09:01] Rachel Siegel: Yeah, I am. I've been like, so far, all of the songs are written for my own project. I write acoustically on a piano and then I take it to different producers and we co-produce them out. I'm co-producing creatively, they're the ones programming. But we're, I'm very involved in the process and, and it has been something that I was very intimidated by and like, And like shied away from for a long time and I thought I was sort of waiting for someone to give me my sound, but it's been really empowering to like grow as like a no, like, like being able to recognize that my ideas are valuable and like I kind of am the only way to make my music.

And so that's been a big journey, but I'm definitely growing in confidence and in like the more I empower myself. To try the, like, the better it gets.

[00:10:00] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Sure. What, what would you say? Oh, go ahead.

[00:10:03] Rachel Siegel: but also I'm working with amazing collaborators and so not taking all the credit at all. It's very collaborative.

[00:10:10] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Yes. Wonderful. When you're figuring out your sound, what, what sounds do you feel contribute the most to that right now? If you could, if you could, I know that's a really difficult thing to label, but I'd love to hear your take on it.

[00:10:25] Rachel Siegel: Yeah, it is different because I think like I love a very like wide and wild and diverse range of like, of music and so I am deeply inspired by Fleetwood Mac and Kanye West and Carol King and and. The words are, there's a name I'm looking for. Oh, and John Beon and Chance the Rapper. And like my taste is very diverse and so I, I know that in making my music, I haven't found it yet.

I'm still trying to create something that I have yet to touch. But I collect like elements from different things that I'm like, that I love. And so right now I'm. A little obsessed with like eighties female rockers, like such as Bonnie Tyler and Don Joan Jet. There's like this ferocious like growl and like desperation and hunger in some of their music that I'm really relating to.

And so in these next songs, I'm. Just trying to explore like, where do I live in that world? Where does that live, that world, live in my music? And, and and trying to like apply that and also just play. I'm trying to just like play and not be so serious with it and be willing to try.

[00:11:59] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Yeah. It's funny because if you were to go and try to like completely imitate, you know, Joan Jet or. Exactly one of those songs of what, what I think is so cool about artistry and individuality and things is it would sound like you, right? So even if, even if you're trying to do a carbon copy of something, it's like if it, if it's really something that inspires you and you love, it's gonna come out.

With a piece of you attached to it. So I think that's what's really fun about discovering your sound as an artist is, is that process of just loving art and even like the highest source of flattery, right? You're copying and trying to, trying to get into their, their sounds. And in doing so, you come up with your own sound, which is really cool.

[00:12:48] Rachel Siegel: I love that. Like, that's cool because it's like, just by, just by us doing it, even if we were trying to do the same thing, it would still be ours. Like it would still be different and individual. And that is a, that's a really cool perspective.

 I'm looking at Fleetwood Mac and. John Bellion which are obviously very different. And I'm looking at childish Gambino and, and Kanye West and so, and taking these pieces that I love from them. So I don't know that it'll ever be a carbon copy of anything.

[00:13:22] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Right. Yeah, 

[00:13:24] Rachel Siegel: Like 

[00:13:24] Jordan Smith Reynolds: the, the multiple influences, right.

[00:13:27] Rachel Siegel: yeah,

[00:13:28] Jordan Smith Reynolds: That's a good safeguard from that for sure. So,

[00:13:31] Rachel Siegel: absolutely.

[00:13:32] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Yeah. So you came from Berklee College of Music and in your bio and I was at New England Conservatory, so we were neighbors for a bit potentially if we were at the same time. You said you lived on Tremont, right?

[00:13:46] Rachel Siegel: I 

[00:13:46] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Yeah. Is that right? Okay. Yeah, I was Mass Avenue in Tremont, so

[00:13:49] Rachel Siegel: Oh my gosh.

[00:13:50] Jordan Smith Reynolds: yeah. Were you on Mass Ave as 

[00:13:52] Rachel Siegel: live in? Yeah, I, I lived in the piano factory.

[00:13:56] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Oh, oh yeah.

Uhhuh. 

[00:13:58] Rachel Siegel: did you live?

[00:13:59] Jordan Smith Reynolds: I think that was just like a block over from where I was at the Piano Factory. I had a few friends there. 

[00:14:05] Rachel Siegel: That is so wild. 

[00:14:07] Jordan Smith Reynolds: I was at the South End Historical Society. I dunno if you saw that building. It's

[00:14:12] Rachel Siegel: I'm sure that I did.

Small world. 

[00:14:14] Jordan Smith Reynolds: When abouts were you there in Boston?

[00:14:17] Rachel Siegel: I was there I moved to Boston 2012 and I was there until 2016.

[00:14:25] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Okay, so we, I think we just missed each other cuz I was there, I was there 16 to 18, so it

was, or 16 to 19. I ended up moving a different apartment, so I wasn't quite there, but yeah. That's so fun. I, I missed Boston. I missed the big winter, which was right before

[00:14:44] Rachel Siegel: You did 20, 20 15. Winter was insane. I remember I have friends who built an igloo and put a recording studio in the igloo and filmed like videos, like it was hysterical.

[00:15:00] Jordan Smith Reynolds: I love that. That's so funny. Did you work with Pat pat Pattinson at all? In Berkeley?

[00:15:07] Rachel Siegel: yeah. Pat was like my mentor. 

He was brilliant 

[00:15:11] Jordan Smith Reynolds: That's 

[00:15:11] Rachel Siegel: and so kind. He would like meet with me like an hour every week, which was so kind.

[00:15:19] Jordan Smith Reynolds: That's really cool. Yeah, I, I just know him from the book. I was reading his book as I was going to school and applying that to all my songwriting stuff and I've 

[00:15:28] Rachel Siegel: my gosh. So 

cool. 

[00:15:29] Jordan Smith Reynolds: from it. Yeah.

[00:15:31] Rachel Siegel: Yeah, it's, it's, I think what's special about that is like, I had only written three songs in my life before I came to Berklee and I came there and I was like, I'm gonna become a songwriter if it's the last thing I ever do in my life. And his like methods gave me like real practical way to start and like, A real practical, like knowledge of, and like toolbox.

Like, if I do this, I can get this reaction and like, and it's like proven and physiological and kind of scientific. And so it was like a amazing way to learn because then I, I can always leave those rules, but when I'm in a room or when I'm working through a song, I always have, like, if I get stuck, I always have something to go back to.

[00:16:20] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Sure. Can we talk about like two of your favorites of those?

[00:16:25] Rachel Siegel: sure. And I think what comes to mind right now is like, like tension. And so I think like tension can come through, like line length the amount of lines in a section or like singing a, a note that's not in the chord you're playing, and which I do all the time. I'll like, like I'll sing something that's out of the chord that's being played and, and, and it like adds tension and like, and I know if I'm talking about heartache or talking about something that's not resolved that's like a great That can just help like hammer in that feeling for people, like for a

listener. And I would say, so that's one, but there's like a many concepts in that. And then learning song form in the way that he teaches and just like, like really getting that in my head and like, like, I don't know. It. That was so powerful because I only had the reference of what I heard growing up, which is amazing. Like we know so much and can feel so much inherently, but but having to like work through his workbooks and like Practice doing these tools.

So like practice writing a verse, refrain, practice writing a song that like, like has this kind of verse or that kind of verse like, was so powerful and, and you work through it and you just like see how it feels to practice the different forms. And then, and then it's. It's easy to learn, like, oh, if I'm, if I'm going for this feeling, I can, I know that that's maybe a great place to start because I, I can recognize what that feels like.

[00:18:18] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Mm. Yeah. Very cool.

Yeah, 

[00:18:21] Rachel Siegel: hope that, I hope that made sense.

[00:18:24] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Yeah. Yeah. Shout out Pat Pattinson. That's, that's great. So you got the degree from Berkeley, and then did you come to LA pretty, pretty soon after that in your artist's journey?

[00:18:36] Rachel Siegel: Yeah, I was working in, in a wedding band, so I, I finished in December 15, and then I stayed in Boston, working in the wedding band until the next September, and then I came to LA in 2016.

[00:18:52] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Great. And did you come because you got that you landed that wedding band gig, or did you come here and then find that Or how did that,

[00:19:00] Rachel Siegel: No. So I was working in the wedding band for three years while I was in

[00:19:04] Jordan Smith Reynolds: oh, I'm sorry.

[00:19:05] Rachel Siegel: So I, and No, that's okay. I ended the wedding band. I said, never again. Fingers crossed. And I, I came to LA to start my journey as like a songwriter and an artist.

[00:19:16] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Mm-hmm. Very cool. And we were talking a bit before this that you've gotten into acting quite a bit as well, and that's kind of been a good support to your music, and you wanna talk

[00:19:25] Rachel Siegel: I have. 

[00:19:26] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Yeah.

[00:19:27] Rachel Siegel: Sure. I've, I've worked in commercials for a while now and I've recently, like over the last year and a few months, I've fallen in love with like improv comedy. So I'm just like having so much fun. Playing and it really has changed my perspective, I think as songwriter. It's easy to think of things like. In terms of thoughts, feelings, and emotions and like my internal world, but improv, at least the, the style that I'm learning, it's very like short form comedy. It's so, it's how can you move this forward with what's in front of you right now? And that change of perspective has been really powerful for my work on every level.

[00:20:14] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Yeah, I imagine songwriting has so much I was putting it in the lens of songwriting as you were saying that, and I can see all the benefit you could get in that world from your work in improv. That's really cool.

[00:20:25] Rachel Siegel: Yeah, absolutely. And it's been, and it's just been so fun to do something like, it's so easy to take things so seriously and it's like the pursuit and love and what you want and, and it's been so fun to like do something that has. Such lower stakes for me, you know, and something that's just, I get to go play and like I get to show up and be outrageous and someone leaving my class.

The other like last week was like, you always say the most outrageous things. Like, I can't believe it. And like literally I just go in and I'm just like, just go with it. No judgment. And so like that's been really freeing.

[00:21:08] Jordan Smith Reynolds: That's awesome. Do you have much experience in the sync world like getting music placed in syncs or have you tried to get your music in syncs? What, what's that look like for your career?

[00:21:19] Rachel Siegel: I would love to. Like a better established avenue for like, for doing syncs but I've yet to find like the way that that's gonna work for me. I've pitched a little bit but over the last couple weeks there are some doors potentially opening. So I'm hopeful that like, cuz I know that can be a great avenue.

Like I'm really hopeful to explore, like doing work in that world a little more.

[00:21:51] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Yeah. So to clarify, for the audience, sync is referring to synchronization, which is getting. Your music onto film for a TV or a commercial or, any sort of avenue with, with that medium. And it can be pretty lucrative.

So it's, it's a nice support for an independent artist when it happens. And I was, I was thinking with the song that you played today, hell of a good time feels like it would fit really well in a lot of like ad situations, you know, where there's people just kind of feeling themselves and having a good time with whatever product it is someone selling.

[00:22:26] Rachel Siegel: Yeah.

Yeah. I mean, well if, if, if the right commercial comes around, absolutely 

[00:22:34] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Yeah. 

[00:22:35] Rachel Siegel: in.

[00:22:36] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Yeah. And I wonder cuz you're doing so much commercial work, if that could just like serendipitously kind of take shape. You know, it's, it's hard cuz I don't know how much ex exposure you get to. People that would be making the music decisions and commercials when you're on set filming, but I imagine you do get some relationships that can lead to others and all that sort of thing too.

[00:23:00] Rachel Siegel: Yeah, I'm, I'm curious too, because I don't, it feels a little separate. Like that feels like it's a decision made in like post-production. And so when you're on set, like, I don't know who makes the final decision, but like I know that like like a music supervisor would probably place the music for it.

So, yeah, I need to do some research and see like who those people are, but on set, I don't think there would be like a music supervisor, or at least I've never encountered one.

[00:23:30] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Yeah, so it may be more of like you become friends with someone that's more in the creative, maybe directing kind of side of it, and then those relationships kind of just naturally blossom. It's so, it's so weird how those connections form, like, I was able to get a sync and the, the sink that I got was because someone was looking for like a UF Stevens Z looking thing.

And they posted that in this LA songwriting community Discord channel.

[00:23:59] Rachel Siegel: Oh, cool.

[00:24:00] Jordan Smith Reynolds: through that I met someone who was like in TV and was able to get a pla like my first placement through it. So it's like, it's wild, the path. Thank you. But you know, it's just crazy to, to find those paths. It's, if you, if you like look for it, you can't find it.

But if you're like being active and showing up, then those paths kind of appear, is what I've noticed. So,

[00:24:21] Rachel Siegel: I think that, I think that's like everything in show business. It's like when you're so laser focused on getting it, like maybe it works sometimes, but a lot of times it just, like the opportunities come from just like fully showing up and being present and like doing the best with like everything that you're like encountering.

[00:24:42] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Yeah, absolutely.

[00:24:43] Rachel Siegel: Yeah 

[00:24:44] Jordan Smith Reynolds: so. Yes, we're excited for hell, hell of a good time is out now so everyone can

listen to that. Yes, please go. Please go check that out. Is there

[00:24:54] Rachel Siegel: Please go stream it on all platforms.

[00:24:58] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Is there anything we should be looking out for you?

[00:25:01] Rachel Siegel: Yes, there is so much coming this year. The next, the next, the next day, next forever. But my next single will be out it's called My Revenge. It is. A hell of a good time. Wink, wink. And excuse me, that was really corny, but it's, I, it's very special to me. It's a song that is about. Realizing you're good and that like you're fully living your life. And that's kind of the best revenge is just like being good. And so it feels very empowering, very current for me. And I'm really excited to hear how you guys connect with it too. So keep an eye out.

[00:25:47] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Thank you and I, I can speak because I've heard it about this ASCAP event as you're getting feedback on it. And I love that concept. I think lyrically it's a great song, song concept and I'm excited to hear how everyone reacts to it as well. L. So where else where can we find you, Rachel, on socials and things like that.

[00:26:07] Rachel Siegel: Yeah, great question. I am @rachel.m.siegel, s i e ge l on Instagram and on TikTok, @rachel.m.siegelmusic. And then you can find me Rachel Siegel, everywhere else. And my website, if anyone's curious, is rachelsiegelmusic.com.

[00:26:29] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Wonderful. Awesome. Thanks so much for being on the show today, Rachel.

[00:26:33] Rachel Siegel: Thank you so much for having me. This has been a blast.

[00:26:36] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Awesome. All right, I'll see you soon. Bye.

[00:26:39] Rachel Siegel: All right. Bye.