[00:00:00] Kat Sophia: Hi, I'm Kat Sophia and this is my song, Fade Away.

[00:00:14] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Welcome to the Song Saloon. I'm singer songwriter Jordan Smith Reynolds. Today's guest is Kat Sophia, and I met Kat during a School of Song class. Y'all should check it out. we just did a class with Adrianne Lenker of Big Thief, and I learned a ton.

And I'm sure Kat will say the same. We'll get into it. 

So Kat Sophia is a singer-songwriter that bounces around Orange County and Los Angeles. Sophia's unique fusion of indie country and pop combined dreamy melodies, emotive lyrics in heartfelt storytelling with a dash of sarcasm. In her lyrics, a la Lily Allen, cut with the sincerity of Taylor Swift.

The first song Sophia ever wrote. And we'll be talking about that, too, because that's frustrating, became a finalist of the first songwriting competition. She entered judged by the manager for one of her favorite rock bands, The Offspring often playing locally in the L. A. and SoCal area. She made her international debut at.

Also festival 2022 in the UK and opened for indie folk band Rene and Jeremy this past year She hopes to make it in music, but also can't stop watching Will Sharpe's flowers. It's a forever battle. Welcome cat Hey, thank you so much for being here.

[00:01:29] Kat Sophia: Thanks for having me!

[00:01:30] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Yeah, it was it was fun So I heard this song fade away at an open mic in orange county actually this week that was writers round oc for all of our orange county friends here. You can go check that out, too I remember hearing the song and really connecting to the, the melody and lyric combo. 

So, Yeah, tell me a little bit about fade away.

[00:01:54] Kat Sophia: Yeah, um, so, this song was, yeah, like, like the intro mentioned, it was the first song that I fully wrote, like I'd written kind of I guess poetry before then? But, um, this is the first like, fully formed song that I'd written.

[00:02:11] Jordan Smith Reynolds: that's pretty not fair. I will just say it's a it's a great great first song so Yeah, it's and it's it is comforting to hear that you've done a lot of poetry because that part feels very fleshed out but yeah

[00:02:26] Kat Sophia: Thank you. Oh, that's so validating because I look back on it and I'm like, what was I writing? Um, during some of the parts. But, um, yeah, so, um, I wrote it over the course of, a really long time. I started it when I was, like, 12 or 13, because I was in middle school. And I wrote it, like, when I was laying in bed and staring at my ceiling trying to go to bed.

And then I wrote it in my head and then I It was just the pre chorus, I think, and then I remembered that, and I don't think I ever wrote it down or like recorded it, I just remembered it and then I stuck it in later, and I can talk about that more later, I guess, but, I finished it because one of my teachers in high school encouraged me to finish it.

Well, he kind of, like, pressured me to finish it in, like, a nice way. it's that class I was telling you about where, in high school we were supposed to, like, perform songs for the class. My friends were like, oh you should do one of your own songs, like as a joke, because he goes around and like writes down what cover song we're gonna do, and then I was like, huh, and then he was like, no you're gonna do that, and then I was like, what?

No, I don't actually want to do that. I was like, I haven't even like finished the song yet, I didn't have like half of it, and then he was like, well you're gonna do it, and then I was like, oh my god, like super stressed out, and then the day of the like performance, I was kind of like. Like, thinking that, like, I don't know, he'd let me change.

So, like, I think before class I was like, Oh, can I do a different song? He's like, No, you gotta do that song. So, right before my performance, when someone else was performing, I went outside and, like, wrote the last half just in the hallway with my friend in, like, a few minutes. And then, I haven't changed it since then.

So, that's kind of, I guess, a short version of how it happened.

[00:04:06] Jordan Smith Reynolds: cool. so you performed the song and the world didn't end and it sounds like it probably went well. Yeah, exciting. and it was at, uh, Orange County High School for the Arts, right? OSHA? Is that what that is?

[00:04:20] Kat Sophia: Yeah, OSHA. Yeah, Orange County School of the Arts in Santa Ana. To be, I think, an office building, so there was like seven flights of stairs. And like, I remember one year I had to, my first class was on the seventh floor. So I had to, each floor was like two flights of stairs, so I had to go all the way up.

It was a lot, yeah. Yeah.

[00:04:44] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Very cool. So Fadeaway, can we talk a bit about, what's, the song about to you, like lyrically, and then we'll, we'll get into a live performance.

[00:04:53] Kat Sophia: I don't know if everyone experiences this, but when you like someone so much that you're trying to not like them and, kind of like the anger that comes with that. And also like, cause I was younger, I think there's a lot of, The kind of like newness of it and like trying to deal with it and I think because it's your first time feeling a lot of those emotions when you're younger, you're kind of like it's coming through in such a like raw form, which is like sweet to look back on but at the time when you're experiencing it, you're like this sucks and you're like trying to like push it down as much as you can which is ironic because I feel like when people get older they try to like You Revisit that and get it back.

So yeah, I feel like we're always doing the opposite. But yeah, it's kind of like You know, so like that that raw, Ness of it and like I guess like the frustration that comes with it because I felt like I don't know at the time. It was like if I liked someone it was like there was like nothing I could really do about it.

Whereas like I feel like now I have more of like a handle on my emotions. Like I can control my emotions a bit more. Whereas like then I definitely couldn't. So, in this song there's a lot of frustration coming through. Cause I feel like a lot of people will sometimes like after I perform it be like, Oh that was such a romantic song.

And to me it's not a romantic song. It's very like a little bit of FU, but like a mild version of that. Like, if FU is the spicy salsa, this is the mild salsa, I guess. yeah, so it definitely, I think, is a bit more like that. Yeah, me collecting kind of different. It's not all about like one person or one experience So it's like all the different times I felt that kind of emotion, I guess smashed into one Yeah

[00:06:41] Jordan Smith Reynolds: I think that's a great place to transition. So I'd love to hear the live performance now, if that sounds good to you.

[00:06:47] Kat Sophia: Okay, cool

[00:06:49] Jordan Smith Reynolds: All right, that was awesome

[00:10:09] Kat Sophia: Thank you.

[00:10:10] Jordan Smith Reynolds: i'd like to start with the chorus When did the chorus come into the picture? You mentioned the pre chorus kind of being a middle school thing When did yeah, when did the chorus appear?

[00:10:22] Kat Sophia: Yeah. the chorus was when I was in early high school. Oh, I forgot what movie it was, but I watched a movie. I think it was like a rom com or something. I don't know when the movie ended, I just wrote the chorus in my head and then I was like, Oh, I like that.

So then I think I recorded it at that point. Um, just into my voice memos and stuff. And then, Yeah, that happens to me a lot, like, after I watch a movie or after I listen to, like, I just watched the, um, Joni Mitchell Grammy performance and I, like, wrote almost a whole song after that because I was so, like, moved.

It was so, like, beautiful. But, um, yeah, so, like, after I, like, watch a performance or, like, listen to a song I like or, like, watch a movie, a lot of times stuff spills out, like, super quickly, which is kind of

[00:11:10] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Yeah, what does that look like? Is it like freeform writing? Are you rhyming stuff? What, yeah, what does that spill onto the page look like?

[00:11:19] Kat Sophia: Well with this song it was everything at the same time so I just came up with the entire thing and then I remember when I Thought of the shut me up line. I was like, can people say that in songs? I like was so like green to it. I'd never like done it. So I was like that seems really like intense But I don't know.

I think that's like my favorite part of the song So I'm glad that I didn't change that but that's it just how it came out like lyrics melody at the same time and then all my early songs like the guitar parts not really like You A part of the song. It's more just like the the underline on it , But I think if one's gonna be in the lead, it's probably lyrics first.

[00:12:03] Jordan Smith Reynolds: That's cool.

[00:12:03] Kat Sophia: know. I'm a lyric person. I like lyrics.

[00:12:06] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Yeah, same. Um, i'm really drawn to lyrics and the shut me up and use me line I'll let your rhythm move me. We've we talked earlier before this episode about Lizzy McAlpine and how that's a big influence for you that feels very lizzie mcalpine universe to me. 

[00:12:22] Kat Sophia: Really? That's such a cool comment.

[00:12:24] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Yeah

[00:12:24] Kat Sophia: Cool! Yeah, I hadn't heard her by that point, but like, That makes a lot of sense because I would probably be drawn to Her kind of stuff if like that was the kind of stuff I was writing at the time. 

[00:12:39] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Yeah, I heard that lyric it's influence and also though I feel like the melody for the chorus the

Going up there didn't quite make it but whatever i'll i'll pitch correct in post. Um, Yeah,

[00:12:59] Kat Sophia: when you're saying

[00:13:00] Jordan Smith Reynolds: that's what i'll do just for this episode

[00:13:04] Kat Sophia: Yay

[00:13:04] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Um, But yeah, I think that melody is extremely strong so when you'd written that that was a kind of at the same time thing you said the lyric and that part of the melody for the chorus? I want to stay inside

[00:13:17] Kat Sophia: I I wrote it, yeah, that was all at the same time and I um, I imagined it to be really like kind of fast. I wanted there to be like intense drums and like swelling instruments and stuff, but Obviously the way I recorded it, it didn't turn out that way. This song is like difficult because I feel like it could go in so many directions.

But yeah, um, You It all came at the same time and then the verses I just wrote on like a napkin in my bathroom like I was just in my feels and then I just wrote it on a napkin and then it like Flew around my room for a bit and then I was like just trying to piece together a Song and then I grabbed that and then I was like Thinking through my bank of memories and like I stuck that in I don't usually write verses Songs like that like ever but that was like

[00:14:10] Jordan Smith Reynolds: like a piece 

[00:14:10] Kat Sophia: a song that I did 

[00:14:11] Jordan Smith Reynolds: here that kind of thing yeah

[00:14:14] Kat Sophia: because I I know that like, um, there's a lot of artists that do that Like even like I think taylor swift does that?

um where she has like a huge bank of lyrics or like people i've written with will have like a bank of lyrics and they're like Oh, let's like refer to that. But usually I just write everything in one go. So this was like interesting because it was like Yeah, so many different ones. I'm usually not patient enough to do that.

But

[00:14:35] Jordan Smith Reynolds: I feel that lately I've been doing a similar thing where it'll be just like a two, three hour session and I'll just get the song finished and let it sit. And then I will do some rewriting later on, but it, it won't be like a piece here and then some more stuff later. And yeah, I guess it's always different.

[00:14:54] Kat Sophia: Do you enjoy it more Like do you enjoy your songs more when they're done quicker? Like do you kind of like that? It's it was like a capturing of like that moment or

[00:15:05] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Really good question. I've had a few songs that I really connect with now. That took me a long time to finish and then the same for the ones that come really quick. So Honestly, I think it just it just depends on the song for me 

[00:15:19] Kat Sophia: Yeah,

[00:15:21] Jordan Smith Reynolds: songs i'll start and then completely rewrite the chorus But like there was a feeling or something that I really liked in it And that feeling stays and just gets amplified as I change the lyrics And then yeah, the 19 i've said this on the podcast before but the 1933 song I wrote The bridge didn't come for like a year yeah, it's kind of both but I love the ones where you just sit down three hours later. You feel good about something. That's a really cool thing

[00:15:47] Kat Sophia: Yeah. That's so cool. Cause, yeah, it's, I like that you said that they're both good in different ways. Cause I think, like, when it's over a long period of time, it's almost like a diary of, like, different snapshots of different moments. And then, like, yeah. And then the other one's more like, this was that one thing, and we got it all that one time.

Or whatever. So,

[00:16:07] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Yeah, kind of like a zoom in zoom out sort of thing. Um

[00:16:11] Kat Sophia: Yeah, 

[00:16:12] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Yeah, so how often are you songwriting is this like a daily practice what is what does your process look like

[00:16:19] Kat Sophia: Oh, um, like, since this song, up until, like, last year, I didn't write that many songs. Like, if you think about how long it had been, I think, what, if we count, like, let's say 13, until now it's been a decade. And, um, That's like, I think I'd written maybe like, 70 to 80 songs up until last year. And that's like, I don't know, not that much in terms of like, 9 to 10 years.

and then within this past year, I've written like, yeah, I've written a decent amount. I would say like, almost. maybe I've written like 70 this past year. So like I've like doubled it in one year Yeah, because I've kind of um like yeah doubled down on Making myself do it and not just being like a thing that I just do when I feel Like doing it like i'm trying to do it more of like a practice and the the school of song thing you were talking about that definitely helped I really liked the deadlines because I'd never had like You Besides fade away, I guess, like deadlines for things.

And so, that was really awesome. And I liked, knowing that I would have three songs by the end of that. but yeah, I think a lot of it was getting over the slower rate previously was more because of, I guess, um, I think this is really common in, like, immigrant families where there's a lot of, like, fear surrounding, a child getting really invested in, like, artistic pursuits or just creative things to a degree that's, like, more than just, like, a hobby.

So I kind of, like, wanted to, Follow that I'd always try to like, I don't know pursue something more like financially stable and all those things but There's just a series of like a bunch of different events that led me to be like Well, I should just like try and I already feel like now I'm like, like starting really late, but I was like the longer I wait the later it's gonna be I was like even though I feel like it's late now.

It's not super late. So I'll try now and and yeah, I think It's just hard because we're, uh, it's not like encouraged, definitely discouraged. And there's a lot of like, um, kind of like feelings of like, we didn't move so that this would happen. Cause like, I feel like a lot of other families, if they've kind of lived here longer, it's been diluted enough that by that, by that point, it's like, Oh, like we want to invest in, this kid being creative, especially going to like OSHA.

Like I had a lot of friends whose parents like were so like, I'll drive you to all your auditions. And like, you know, I had friends who like their parents would like pick up a second job so they could send them to like a nice arts college and things like that. Just like a lot of, yeah, at the time I thought it was like they're like not supportive, but I know now it's just more like fear, cause to us that's like a lot less known, I guess like our family is like, pretty close to, Me, relative wise, um, so my relatives, like, had to worry about, you know, just putting food on the table so they weren't thinking about getting a guitar and, like, writing songs and things like that, and I think there's, like, some guilt, too, that I was feeling of, like, oh, like, that's not fair that, like, they were doing that kind of thing, and now I'm, like, Being so self indulgent, writing about myself.

So yeah. So I think that was like a huge block that took like years because I've known since I was like in high school that I wanted to at least like do more music and I had to get over that block. It took like years.

[00:20:09] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Okay. 

I would love to hear more about how you unblocked yourself from that because I think, that's something that I feel like I've had to work through on a, on a different scale. but the whole like self indulgent artist thing, because. As an artist putting out music, there is a level of self indulgence that has to be, has to be part of it, right?

But, then you can, I don't know, you can just, you can look at it in so many different ways. Like, oh no, but I'm doing it and people connect with it. And then that is meaningful for other people's lives. But really a lot of the time I'm writing to, to work through stuff internally and for myself. and so from my perspective, you know, I've got two, almost three kids and supporting, like trying to support the family, but also really wanting to pursue my artistic goals.

And, I can feel that way a bit when I'm like, oh, well, 

[00:21:00] Kat Sophia: um, 

[00:21:00] Jordan Smith Reynolds: I just, really went out and tried to full time get a web job or something, I'd be a much better place to support a family. I'd love to hear more about how you unblocked part of yourself.

[00:21:14] Kat Sophia: Dang, okay, after you explain that now, I want to like, hear your, your

[00:21:18] Jordan Smith Reynolds: give some of mine

[00:21:19] Kat Sophia: Um, but, okay, cool. Yeah, because I'm so used to being the interviewer, like, when I, for my newspaper job, like, my journalism job. So I'm like, oh my god, I want to hear more about that. Like, I'm like, but, uh, Also just like in general before I start like I think I do think Asian culture is more like I mean it is I'm not this is like not an I think it's more collectivist versus individualist And so like even in school growing up I never wanted to talk about like me like during class or anything but like Kids who kind of like spoke first were always rewarded like being individualistic is rewarded here and I always felt like I was catching up because The way I was raised was like so anti that so I think when I think of art and like music being self indulgent, I think about like It's so like difficult for me that like even after going to like an event where like you're supposed to meet other artists and talk about your music or you're supposed to like or even just like performing like I'll come home and I'll just be like so like self conscious like oh my god like who cares like what I have to say like just like, talking about myself exhausts me.

I haven't like, practiced that in a long time and like, kind of being a people pleaser and kind of not talking about yourself is, it became kind of like a crutch, like a way to like, protect myself. Like, it's kind of really easy for me to be like, the listener or like, yeah, the person who's like, not talking about their own things or like, not.

Like, I don't know, like, thinking about what I want and like, going for what I want, like, it's kind of just like a, a safety blanket, which, there's just a lot of comfort that came with that, and it's, it's just easier, , I would, Get like so, like, yeah, exhausted and just kind of like sad after anything like music related or anything like Related to being an artist or whatever and I'd like to say that I had some like Huge epiphany an internal like switch where I was like I can do this and I like looked in the mirror and I was like I got this, but like that's definitely not how it went.

It was very, um, like dependent on other people, which still goes along with like the, the people pleasing aspect, which I don't necessarily think is like a good thing, by the way. But, yeah, I think a lot of it was, uh, other people. So. I, like, had this dude reach out to me on Instagram who was like, Hey, I saw, like, an article about you in, like, a newspaper.

Cause, the newspaper I work for did, like, a little article on me. And I talked about my music. And then he's like, I'd love to hear your music. And so I sent it. And then he Really liked it and kind of like followed me for like a year before we actually like met each other and was like I don't know my first like fan who like didn't know who I was and I hadn't even put anything out on like Spotify or anything I think I'd only put like a few videos up on YouTube But he had like a lot to say like when we met up he was like I really like the melodies on this The way that your voice kind of does this like thing where it like flips upwards at the end of some of your notes like things that I like I didn't even notice those types of things or like he's like the way you sang in like this demo was like really emotional and like I don't know I was like what like there's enough substance for someone to even say those things like that was crazy to me and like I don't know I Put those things out at the time thinking no one was looking at them.

And so, I think having just a fan, who had no reason to say anything, say that, was really cool. And then I think just, Affirmations from like, friends or just people who aren't my friends just saying nice things. I like applied for a music program and then they like called me in and they're like We've never called anyone in for a meeting before or like they didn't say that I asked them I was like, do you guys do this a lot?

Because they like Held a meeting with me and they gave me a bunch of pamphlets for different schools. They were like, We think, like, you're accepted into the program, but we think you should, like, try out for these schools, too, because we think they're, like, a really, like, tailored fit to your music. Your music is so, like, cool, like, you should just, like, go out and gig, and just, like, put it out there.

And then I was like, do you guys, like, hold meetings like this a lot? And they were like, no, we've, like, never done this before. We just, like, think that, you know. It was worth the effort of, like, kind of meeting with you and doing all this and stuff, and I was like, whoa, and like, I don't know, there's like a lot of different ones, or like, even after the songwriting competition, with my song, that's the only, I think, one I've ever entered, and like, cause I'm, I think I have a fear of, like, failure, but, um, they, like, people afterwards were so nice, and like, I think it's just taken, like, a ton of people like saying like Your writing is good.

Your singing is good Like because I just thought my writing was bad and my singing was bad, but I just enjoyed both

[00:26:26] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Uh huh

[00:26:27] Kat Sophia: Um, and even like that class I was telling you about where I wrote Half a fade away before it like having my classmates just be like oh like your singing is really good Just yeah having people say those things helps me Because I think my biggest fear in life is Not my biggest fear like obviously that's like loved ones dying and stuff, but like I guess my biggest kind of like social fear is like thinking like your thought of yourself is like higher than what everyone else is thinking.

And so I guess that fear is, I think I needed a lot more on the bank of people saying things for me to feel like, okay, I can take one step forward and, like, maybe perform one song, and then I can take another step forward of, like, writing more songs Okay, like my skill is something worth investing in and things like that So I feel like I have a ton of examples I wanted to just distill it to a few because that would take forever, but I think there's just a lot of Yeah those moments And which again, I wish I could say that it was just me, but it was definitely not it was people Like saying things because like words mean a lot to me.

That's like kind of my love language. So Having people say things definitely You does that make sense? Like having like the bank of what people have said be high, like as high as like what I'm willing to do. I want to get to a point where like, I can just do whatever and not have to rely on them.

But

[00:27:57] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Sure. Yeah, so community it sounds like is really the driver and what has helped you kind of bring your art forward And decide to focus on it 

[00:28:06] Kat Sophia: yeah, I would say so. Yeah,

[00:28:10] Jordan Smith Reynolds: I would like to Get into more of the self indulgent thing too is how did how did you get over that part in particular?

I feel like oh, well It's not no longer self indulgent because people in the community are also Invested in this thing. Is that is that what you're saying?

[00:28:26] Kat Sophia: yeah, I think that's kind of what I was trying to say. You, you explained it way better than me just now. But yeah, I think it was like, I think knowing that people connect, it's like so sweet. When I was in like middle school, I drew this, it was like, what do you want most in the world? And like, I don't know, I feel like a lot of people just did like very like normal things.

But like, I drew like a bunch of hearts connected to each other. And I was like, I want to like, touch people's hearts. That was like what I wrote. And like, I feel like, That sentiment has probably like stayed the same and I, I, when people say those types of things I'm like Holy moly, when someone like after a show is like, oh like you made me think about this person It was so helpful.

Like I needed to hear that or like it made me so emotional because of XYZ or like at one of my shows someone was like my sister passed away recently and your song made me think of like the super it was about like my song about hot cheetos which is so like stupid like that song but like she was like I have memories of um like She would like, I don't want to like give away the whole story, but like she would feed her sister who was paralyzed and then her sister ended up passing away.

But like, um, it was always like hot Cheetos, like she'd always like buy them for her and they'd like eat them together and stuff. And I was like, Oh my God, that's like, so like cool. I don't know. Um, just instances like that, that keep happening. And, yeah. And I think that makes me feel like

it's not even that I directly think about that when I'm doing it, but I think it just makes it seem like it's not such a self indulgent thing, and so like, it's like ice chipped off over and over and over, until there's like, less, and you're able to kind of like, start melting it, and like, in the middle of it, you can actually try to, I guess, keep doing it.

I don't know if that like, I guess that's that visual. But, um, yeah.

[00:30:20] Jordan Smith Reynolds: um, I think Yeah to talk more about this this point I think there's a level of selfishness that is healthy for humans, like, just because self is part of that, and selfish gives it that negative connotation, but, it is very important to be in tune with yourself, and that's really the only way we can connect with others, and I love that story of you, like, doing the heart thing as a kid because that, that resonates with me a lot too is, people that are pursuing art full time versus we're all, I believe, okay, we're going to get a little bit more holistic and things, but I think everyone is an artist.

and, should be expressing creativity in some way, or they're like, you know. their lives become duller. I do think that everyone should have a creative outlet, even if they aren't pursuing, an artist career, you know? I think what people want is to be seen and heard and understood.

And when we put our art out there. That's kind of what we're seeking to do. And the best art in the world is what makes you feel seen and heard, even though, like in your own story by someone else's piece of art and connecting that way. So.

[00:31:26] Kat Sophia: I agree.

[00:31:27] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Yeah, so I think that would be my answer too. I think you did it for me that's what's important to me is that connection with people and for me that's worth the The sacrifice and everything that goes into a life of an artist

I treasure that connection with people over over other things 

[00:31:44] Kat Sophia: Well, that's really fascinating that you brought up like, connecting with others because, yeah, if you like, understand yourself more, or you can be the person who can provide that kind of like, feeling seen or heard, or just do that through other people's music, I feel like, yeah.

writing about your experiences probably makes you better to those around you too if like you understand yourself more because like if you're always thinking about other people then who are you right like so yeah i i really like your

[00:32:19] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Yeah, and I think that's why we gravitate towards people like You know lil nas x or bowie or just like kind of these big personality people Because in a way we like the idea of being able to to do those similar things and be so self assured but there's also a lot of people that connect with kind of that more people pleasing mentality and And I think that's where people like Lizzie McAlpine really fit in like dealing with those kind of emotions Yeah, Phoebe Bridgers, you know Boygenius that sort of, circuit, I think is really great for that side of things too, where it's not as much like gigantic personalities in your face and more, focused on connection.

I don't know if that makes sense. Um, cause it's all about connection. They're just, they're just different types. 

[00:33:07] Kat Sophia: Yeah.

[00:33:07] Jordan Smith Reynolds: yeah. Well, thank you so much for this. where can people find you online?

[00:33:12] Kat Sophia: Spotify, Apple Music, etc. And then, um, Instagram is @katsophiamusic

 oh, and like Bandcamp and things like that. YouTube, I'm just like trying to name them. Yeah,

[00:33:30] Jordan Smith Reynolds: I'll make sure those links are in the episode notes So if you all want to check out Kat Sophia's music, please do so Do you have anything coming out soon or something that we should be looking for shows anything like that

[00:33:42] Kat Sophia: yeah on Spotify. 

I've been trying to release a song every week or two. So I've been like really like whether they're just like really rough demos or whatever. So I'm trying to like. Yeah, do demos of all the songs we did during school song and then Like yeah a bunch of other songs that I just have written and then i'm doing like my first band show on february 27th at hotel zakey in la um

all my other show info will be on my instagram I guess because I have other shows that i'm doing Doing I'm trying to like play live as much as possible as I told you like a few days

[00:34:20] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Yeah

[00:34:21] Kat Sophia: But yeah, hopefully like I can try to record. more stuff like Professionally, I want to learn how to produce i'm taking the Philip Weinrobe

[00:34:29] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Yeah, I'm so jealous

[00:34:31] Kat Sophia: hopefully that helps a little

bit 

[00:34:34] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Yeah, if I hadn't

[00:34:35] Kat Sophia: I'll let you know if I like learn anything really

[00:34:37] Jordan Smith Reynolds: please do. Um, because I was really interested in that class as well. For people listening, Philip Weinrobe has done, uh, Adrianne Lenker's past few records, right? I don't know how involved he was in Big Thief stuff. I don't think he has been. Has he been in Big Thief stuff, too?

Do you know?

[00:34:54] Kat Sophia: I don't think so. I think they had one producer for like, most or all, which wasn't

[00:34:59] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Yeah, but he's done at least the solo record stuff And I played the last Adrian Linker record like Over and over and over. so I've listened to his work at least through that I think that class would be really great. And I also have that that goal. I want to work on more production stuff So that's really cool to hear so spotify.

You'll get a lot of Kat Sophia content if you go follow on spotify And yeah, I think that's so great. You're releasing it in even if you feel like it's not a fully produced state quick quick question Turned back to fade away. What what was the production story for that? getting that produced?

[00:35:35] Kat Sophia: Oh yeah, I feel like we barely talked about the song, I feel so bad. yeah, we uh, yeah, the production, like I said, this is such a weird song, and the fact that like it can go in so many different directions, like it could be slow and be pretty in a different way, and then it could be like fast and urgent.

I basically just like, with a friend, Who's really talented. I basically was like, I have no idea how to use any DAW. At the time, I also didn't, like, Adrianne didn't know what a DAW was. and I was the kind of person who on GarageBand like, made a new track for every single thing, so there'd be like, a hundred different tracks if I did like, harmonies and different guitar parts.

Like, I was like, Not only would I just make a different track for everything, it would be like, I played a little bit of guitar, and then like, a new track, and like, the next little bit of guitar was so bad. So, and my friends who actually produce would look at it and be like, anxiety. So, um, they were like, okay, like, I just need someone to help me like who knows how to use it and then like I know what I want So I knew like bare bones what I wanted He ended up using my scratch guitar like just the practice guitar in the produced one which I was like horrified about I was like That was like my rough take and he's like no we need to like use this so he like Put that in which was like cool to have like a objective person kind of make fun choices.

And then um Yeah, just trying out different sounds and seeing what sound would get together, like, adding things in, taking things out, and then I'd be like, I want this, and then I'd be like, turn that up, like, super loud, and he'd be like, that's a little too loud, and I'd be like, no, like, we need a lot of that, like, he'd be like, okay, like, so, it was just a lot of me, like, being like, I want this and this and this, which is, like, kind of my dream, because I hate using any technology, so being able to, like, just be like, I want this.

So, pretty much all the ideas were mine. He added in a few, like, Like, whaaaat? Like, kind of like, um, otherworldly, ethereal, like, I think there's like two in there? At random parts, where they kind of

[00:37:37] Jordan Smith Reynolds: things or

[00:37:39] Kat Sophia: Yeah, exactly, like something, so I would say like, I want it to feel like it's like, Pushing you into the chorus and then he'd be like, oh, so something like this so Like there were like two things where he came up with the exact sound because I said I wanted like a certain feeling or whatever or like Energy going into a certain section of the song.

So But pretty much all of the like I guess choices and things like that were pretty much just me saying things which is Really cool. I think that's One facet of being like I don't know, to me a good producer is like being able to listen and like Work on it like teamwork and stuff and not Stamp all over it.

so yeah, that's kind of how it worked and then Once I actually knew how to use ableton a bit more I kind of went in and like, you know tweaked really like minor things and then I just sent it to a mastering guy who did a really good job and then, uh, that's about it. I think also, like, the, like, ahhh part in the beginning, he was super against that, but I was like, I want something really, like, weird in the beginning, and then, Also, I was really I forgot to mention this. I was really ill the day I recorded the vocals but I'd driven all the way up to LA already, so I wanted to at least try because he's like we can just do it another day and I was like i'm already here I'm, just gonna try I was like really sick.

Like I probably sounded like like a a monster when I was like speaking, at least to myself. so I tried to sing and I think There might have been a bit of like, I know in um, Semisonic's closing time like the producer made him sing the song like a ton of times and then He sounded like he was gonna like die By the like the last take and then they use that for the chorus And if you listen to his isolated vocals, it sounds like he's sick So I I did kind of have that.

Hopefully like there is a good Vibe to the song because people have been like, oh, I like your vocals on it. And I'm like, yay because I was very self conscious about that. so i'm Yeah, hanging on for dear life in the vocals for sure

[00:39:48] Jordan Smith Reynolds: That's funny, I've heard that with a few other artists. you mentioned semi sonic. I've heard the Beatles have done that a few times. Like, I'm pretty sure Twist and Shout, was one of those where John Lennon's voice was just completely fried and they recorded it.

[00:40:02] Kat Sophia: That totally makes sense when you listen to

[00:40:04] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Cause he's like literally yelling in the entire song. and then Paul McCartney was the same. He does the, um, what's it, oh darling, that's the one it is. and there's recording of

[00:40:17] Kat Sophia: That sounded like Paul McCartney, that was very impressive.

[00:40:20] Jordan Smith Reynolds: thank you yeah his his oh darling track has a lot of that same thing Or I think he just screamed into a pillow for a long time and then decided to record the track But 

[00:40:33] Kat Sophia: Uh, yes. It's for the art, I promise. I didn't just do that because I was sad. Yeah. That's cool, yeah. That's so interesting that that's like a tactic people like intentionally use. so I did that. Oh, and then also like I just took a mic and then I like I did two rounds of like ad libs so there's a ton of like vocal just like Which is like cool cuz a lot of my vocal like Stacking things are because I just don't know how to play other instruments and I don't like like artificial instruments So I use my voice kind of like Out of necessity, but yeah, so I kind of did that as well.

I think there's a lot of just vocal

[00:41:14] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Mm hmm. That's cool. And if I ever get into production, actually, I think that's how I'm going to do it, is more voice based. I've seen a few producers do it that way, like, I know Timbaland talks about it all the time. Like, all of his beats he, like, does as, like, a vocal beatbox thing, and then he gets sounds that, that fill in the little things that he was trying to do.

so even from a beat making standpoint, uh, you can use the voice, which is really cool. so I want to explore that.

[00:41:40] Kat Sophia: That is really

[00:41:41] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Yeah. My, um, one of the past episodes has my friend, Robert Ballantyne uh, Willes on it. And he uses, he literally uses his voice in production with an AI tool that like shapes his voice to different instruments.

So like there's an oboe that uses his voice. So it is really cool.

[00:42:00] Kat Sophia: No way That's so cool! Whoa!

[00:42:06] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Yeah.

[00:42:07] Kat Sophia: Yeah, no, I feel like your stuff even with just with your own voice and not the AI changed I feel like that would be really good for your music because your music is so like uh I know you're saying this about mine, but I really like like your melodies. So I feel like If you wrote other melodies over your stuff, it'd be really cool.

And then like highlighting what you have would be really great because yeah, I don't think your music means a lot of like bells and whistles. It's very like, the bones of it are good. You just need to kind of like, enhance that.

So, that makes sense.

[00:42:42] Jordan Smith Reynolds: So we'll have to keep in touch about the production journey. That would be good to keep working on

that. 

Yeah thank you so much for coming and doing this episode today. I'm excited for people to check out your music yeah, it was so much fun. Thank you

[00:42:54] Kat Sophia: Yeah, thank you for having me. This was super fun. I like, just got into Listening to podcasts, cause I, like, I just put them on when I drive to LA and stuff, so this is like, really fun, cause they, yeah, I just got super into them. Thanks for having me.

me 

[00:43:09] Jordan Smith Reynolds: Yeah. All right Well, i'll see you next time. Thank you so much Bye.

[00:43:13] Kat Sophia: thank you